Posted by: Dale "Head_Hunters" DuPont on January 27, 2003 at 12:53:00

Just for Fun, try this on for size. Well, when you go heavier or lighter hammer, you have to change the hammer spring pressure to get the same 300 fps (all other things remaining equal) The lighter hammer HAS to have the same Inertial Mass to get the same result through the valve. It is mutually offseting somewhat in terms of rate of fire. The recocking mechanism has to offset the heavier spring and thus be theoretically, a tad slower. Not to say the right combinations of front and rear springs, hammer weight etc. wouldn't be 'better'. I agree we are splitting hairs at differences that no finger could achieve in semi mode. But let me tell you about the fastest finger I have ever witnessed in semi mode. A recorded 13 bps on a Dark Angel. I lost a $3 bet. Glad to have paid $3 just to see it.... He had tweaked his trigger pull length and trigger return spring to produce that. It was basically, a response trigger that used the recoil of the marker to cycle the trigger. He just held it still once he got it going. I DON'T want to take away the level of SKILL required by the player to do it. None of 6 other guys standing their could reproduce it when we tried. We could get some really fast bursts but not sustain it for half a second much less 3-4 seconds. Give the guy CREDIT! It would also fire extremely fast if you pointed the barrel straight up.. Gravity on the trigger. Thats how he tuned it. When it would cycle at the right near vertical angle. It would also fire if you shook it, bumped it. Now you appreciate the 'touch' it took to use it in a horizontal position? But think about it? What position would you have to play in a tournament if you couldn't run without it firing spontaneously. Back. Well he did. He could put down some serious covering fire. He is #1 in my very short list of players in our area that actually CAN come close to using ALL the capabilities of an Angel. The rest are want-a-be s.... Relative to your situation, using the marker's recoil to make your electronic trigger act like a response trigger has some merit worth consideration for the tournament player. Recoil from air and ball being propelled forward and a couple of miliseconds before that happens, the hammer is moving forward. Both generate recoil backwards pulse. A heavier hammer and spring would tend to INCREASE recoil. Increasing the excess air discharge too? In-efficiency on purpose? Heck! How about using a heavier gas? Just a crazy thought...... Wouldn't a heavier hammer, ram rod, ram pistion and bolt generate a forward recoil as the bolt closes as it recocks? What impact would a heavier bolt have in all this mili-second timing. Would all this just offset each other and just not be a viable theory relative to the different design of the Angel. Adding to the mass of the trigger could help overcome the friction involved between the trigger and frame. Especially if the center of gravity of the trigger was moved FARTHER away from the pivot point. Wouldn't that increase the potential travel of the trigger forward (relative to the Body) as the result of the recoiling body? Do I have my physics right? I'm just having fun messing with you minds. I don't care. I'm just a rec and scenerio player. Remember?

Follow Ups: Re: Points taken. Lets split the split hair.. Vampyr 20:33:20 01/27/03 (0) Post a Followup Show your name as: DefaultRealnameBothNickname E-Mail address (eg: joeschmoe@aol.com): Show your e-mail address? DefaultYesNo Your Password: Don't have a password? CLICK HERE - Forgot your password? CLICK HERE Subject: Subject:Message: : : Just for Fun, try this on for size. : Well, when you go heavier or lighter hammer, you have to change the hammer spring pressure to get : the same 300 fps (all other things remaining equal) The lighter hammer HAS to have the same Inertial Mass to get the same result through the valve. It is mutually offseting somewhat in terms of rate of fire. The recocking mechanism has to offset the heavier spring and thus be theoretically, a tad slower. : Not to say the right combinations of front and rear springs, hammer weight etc. wouldn't be 'better'. : I agree we are splitting hairs at differences that no finger could achieve in semi mode. : But let me tell you about the fastest finger I have ever witnessed in semi mode. A recorded 13 bps on a Dark Angel. I lost a $3 bet. Glad to have paid $3 just to see it.... He had tweaked his trigger pull length and trigger return spring to produce that. It was basically, a response trigger that used the recoil of the marker to cycle the trigger. He just held it still once he got it going. : I DON'T want to take away the level of SKILL required by the player to do it. None of 6 other guys standing their could reproduce it when we tried. We could get some really fast bursts but not sustain it for half a second much less 3-4 seconds. Give the guy CREDIT! : It would also fire extremely fast if you pointed the barrel straight up.. Gravity on the trigger. Thats how he tuned it. When it would cycle at the right near vertical angle. : It would also fire if you shook it, bumped it. Now you appreciate the 'touch' it took to use it in a horizontal position? : But think about it? What position would you have to play in a tournament if you couldn't run without it firing spontaneously. Back. Well he did. He could put down some serious covering fire. He is #1 in my very short list of players in our area that actually CAN come close to using ALL the capabilities of an Angel. The rest are want-a-be s.... : Relative to your situation, using the marker's recoil to make your electronic trigger act like a response trigger has some merit worth consideration for the tournament player. : Recoil from air and ball being propelled forward and a couple of miliseconds before that happens, the hammer is moving forward. Both generate recoil backwards pulse. A heavier hammer and spring would tend to INCREASE recoil. Increasing the excess air discharge too? In-efficiency on purpose? Heck! How about using a heavier gas? Just a crazy thought...... : Wouldn't a heavier hammer, ram rod, ram pistion and bolt generate a forward recoil as the bolt closes as it recocks? What impact would a heavier bolt have in all this mili-second timing. : Would all this just offset each other and just not be a viable theory relative to the different design of the Angel. : Adding to the mass of the trigger could help overcome the friction involved between the trigger and frame. Especially if the center of gravity of the trigger was moved FARTHER away from the pivot point. Wouldn't that increase the potential travel of the trigger forward (relative to the Body) as the result of the recoiling body? : Do I have my physics right? : I'm just having fun messing with you minds. I don't care. I'm just a rec and scenerio player. Remember? [ Follow Ups ] [ Post Followup ] [ WARPIG Tech Talk - Autococker / Minicocker ]