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WARPIG Tech Talk - Autococker / Minicocker

Re: I am a fan of the stock regulator.....

In Reply to: I am a fan of the stock regulator..... posted by Dale on August 04, 2003 at 19:07:53:


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Posted by:
Vampyr

on August 04, 2003 at 20:53:30

One thing that is nice to do to the stock reg is go to Mcmaster.com and look up their belleville (sp?) springs. get two sets of the lightest 3/4" OD springs. Try to match the height of the stock spring set. It takes on extra spring than stock. What this will do is make the adjustment less touchy at the approximately 250PSI range. It can still adjust a good deal on both sides of that range, but it is a bit more responsive at the lower pressures.
This also applies to the Ergo.

: So you know I'm biased up front. But consistency in muzzle velocities is A PRIMARY PERFOREMANCE GOAL critical to my Auto Rangefinder's performance. Try getting a head shot at 50 yards without CONSISTENT MUZZLE VELOCITY!

: You already have Nitro but your goal, ("I'm looking to increase my overall consistency.") suggests you have "inconsistency" in your muzzle velocities. And looking for a solution.

: I would suggest you look elsewhere for the source of your inconsistency rather than assuming you need to "upgrade" from the stock reg. What you generally get is a knob and a guage. Not a "better" regulator... Watch the marketing people squirm.... And the players that fell for the marketing thing and coughed up the $money.

: I use a stock reg on my 98. The reg has been rebuilt twice.

: I get all of 10 shots within a 5-10 fps range.

: Many 3-5 shot sequences all within 2 to 5 fps of each other.

: 5 fps or less with premium quality paint and 10 fps with field grade paints.

: Simularly, I have a LP valve, Madmann Spring set and have adjusted my stock reg to 300 fps which is as low as I can go with a 18" single stage bore barrel and still get 300 fps out of it.

: Simularly, I use a stock autococker reg that I bought for $20 OFF a guy that just HAD to get a knob to play with when he 'upgraded' his stock regulator. I use it to run my Nerf 'Rocket Propelled Grenade' launcher set at 80 psi to 150 psi. Is THAT low pressure enough for ya?

: Simularly, the stock Reg can keep up with 10 + RPS rates of fire. I have a burst mode that puts 10 balls in the air in one second when I'm taking that 40 yard to 60 yard head shot.

: A 10 shot ball pattern is bigger than human head at those distances. But out of 10 balls, a couple will hit a facemask at 60 yards IF you can get that pattern centered on the guy's nose when you push the burst button.

: If you could get the same performance out of a stock reg that I can consistently get out of MY stock reg, would that be adequate for your goals?

: So I say again, look elsewhere for your velocity inconsistencies. Most are a LOT less expensive than the price of a reg. If you don't do this stuff periodically anyway, you might have to do it AFTER you spent all that money for the reg in order to obtain the results you are looking for.

: To get consistent velocities - CHECKLIST:

: Nitro of your choice.

: Paint Quality. In the 'Quest for Accuracy' paint quality and more specifically "roundness" is critical to BOTH Accuracy AND Consistent Muzzle Velocities. Field paint will have much more inconsistent muzzle velocities than expensive premium paints.

: Remove your barrel use is as a ball "Roundness Guage". Put a ball of your favorite paint in the barrel with the seam touching the walls of the barrel. Hold it up to the light and look for the air gaps between the ball and barrel wall. Take it out, turn it 90 degrees so the seam runs front to back down the bore of the barrel and put the SAME ball back in. Hold it up to the light and look at the air gaps between the ball and barrel wall again. Different huh? So wouldn't it make sense that your muzzle velocity would vary depending on the orientation of the ball seam when it drops into the the chamber? BIG TIME!
: Now for you scientific guys. Repeat the same procedure for 10 balls out of the same bag. It will vary EVEN MORE across a sample of 10 balls.

: Go do the SAME test at your local field or paintball store using a handfull of All Star, Marbs or other expensive premium paint and compare those with the local field grade paint.

: You should literally be able to SEE the difference between that and field paint. Compare that with YOUR favorite paint and make a judgement about what you are willing to pay for paint to achieve your goal of consistent muzzle velocities.

: After paint, Most other muzzle velocity inconsistencies are related to DIRT, Mechanical Condition, and Lubrication. ANYTHING that hangs up, rubs, grinds, etc. will affect velocity in a HUGE way.

: Cleanliness and Routine Maintainence is REQUIRED:

: Tear it ALL the way down, Clean Everything including the INSIDE of the REGULATOR. If it is NASTY, your front regulator, 3 way, and ram need a good cleaning too. TIP: I use CLEAR hoses so I can SEE when the inside is getting dirty. I can then do periodic routine cleaning and maintaince BEFORE problems develop... I have 20 feet of premium Clear Green hose for sale. $10 for 10 FEET!

: Are you due for a $12 rebuild kit? O rings DO wear out.

: Cleaned your reg lately? It is two years old. Right?

: Lubed the Reg INTERNALLY? Ever? It is AMAZING what two drops of 3 in 1 Oil in your ASA hole can do for consistent muzzle velocities. If this HELPS solve your problem, you need to clean and rebuild it. Soon the same old problems will crop up shortly because the O rings are dirty and worn giving you the velocity jumps.

: POLISH your HAMMER!

: This is a CHEAP TRICK with dramatic results. Remove the hammer. Put the cocking rod back into it. Chuck the cocking rod nut into a drill to turn the whole assembly. Use car paint polish on a damp rag. SPIN and POLISH and in about 5 minutes it will have a MIRROR Finish on it. Clean throughly, Lube and RE-Install in your receiver's hammer bore that you have just cleaned throughly while you had it apart anyway....

: This made a HUGE Difference in my consistency with premium paints into the sub 5 fps range of variance of all fired shots.

: ALL THAT didn't cost you more than a Rebuild Kit and a can of car polish.


: But if you just have to get an upgrade, let me know. I've got buddies looking for a RPG regulator and you will have one for sale. Right?

: Get one that does NOT have an external knob. Things that are designed to adjust, tend to get OUT of Adjustment. I like a design with an Allen Wrench adjustment like the Black Magic.

: If you JUST have to have a guage which you WILL need to complete setting up your LP modifications, remember you will ONLY need it while making changes.

: Do you EVER see a guy looking at his regulator guage while playing? No! Just something to break on a rock when you fall down. More weight on your marker. Something to hang on a vine in the brush.

: For $15 you can screw a 1" diameter mini guage 0-500 psi right into the front block plug. Same Thread. You can LEAVE it in there if you want. It is well protected there. I did.

: But if you want a larger guage, it will interfere with the regulator. Spend $5 more for a 90 degree fitting from your local pneumatic supplier and install it in the front block (with the reg removed for clearance) and pointing either right or left side. Then you can install any gauge.

: You might want to go to Macro line fittings while setting up your LP set up. The quick disconnect for easy access to the stock reg to adjust. You won't have to take your bottom line off or grip off to tinker with it.

: Got to run. Good Luck.
: Need any help? E-mail or post here.

:
: : I am looking to upgrade my stock regulator. This is the standard regulator that WGP put on the 01' vert feed cocker. I know that this is a good regulator but I'm looking to increase my overall consistency. I took a look at the black magic and the ergo and they look good. Do they basically have the same internals as the stock WGP regulator and just are externally adjustable? Also does anyone else suggest another regulator? I am currently running my gun at its default pressure and am probably going to go to low pressure in the future so I am looking for a regulator that can handle both.

: : If it helps I am using a 68 ci. 3000 psi. Crossfire with a pre-set regulator.

: : Since I am trying to increase my consistency which would I benefit more from: a new valve or a new regulator?

: : Thanks in advance.



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